O2 Controller - Need urgent help
 

Hey chaps

Some might recall my recent dyno run that looked incredibly lean. As a result I ordered up the O2 controller and Kev mod which arrived today. I just fitted the O2 controller, went for a spin and it is completely unchanged. No difference anywhere. I even stopped by the roadside to unplug and plug it all back in again but really there's no change for better or worse.

This gives me a major problem. In 4 days I leave for a 1500 mile round trip to Skye. If I can't figure out this controller by Thursday, this year's trip is going to be by car. :(

I never did think my XT was too juddery, but I did expect to notice some difference with the O2 controller.

Any ideas?

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Edit: I noticed that Kev states "The closed loop is used for emission control, it comes into effect after a coolant temp of 70 degrees C...". What does the bike do between cold and 70C then? My test was only 5-10 minutes as I expected immediate results from turning the key. Could it be that the coolant didn't reach temperature?

Inspired partly by my desire to attack the bike with wirecutters, and partly by the tumbleweed blowing across this thread, I headed back to the garage with the Kev mod.

My theory, made up entirely of guesswork and assumptions, is that if the bike at cold start doesn't use the closed loop, it must use the open loop. Seems reasonable. So, fitting the Kev mod should mean that when the bike is cold, I can adjust the resistance with the Kev mod and notice a change, right? Wrong. Still nothing.

My lovely wife said as I trudged back into the house, "Why don't you sell the XT and get a bike that just works properly when you buy it, like all the other bikes you've had?". You know what, she might just have something there! :)

O2 controller and Kev mod for sale. Oh, and an XT660. :)

2 hours and 35 minutes is hardly a long time. Please remember that Kev is 12 hours adrift of the UK, he works for a living too. He usually responds as soon as he can.

Patients, is a virtue.

What I meant was "If no-one's got any ideas I'll go and crack on myself". I think when I posted that there had been 25 viewings and no suggestions and I knew Kev wouldn't be online for hours.

you wouldn't happen to get any error codes?
Certain error codes will make the CDI go into a "safe mode" where it totally ignores whatever O2, air intake temp and other sensors tell it.

If not, Kev will be best-placed to help you out.

Thanks for the reply.

I didn't see anything unusual on the LCD display, if that's where an error code would show up.

Firstly you are quite correct the O2 controller only starts working with a coolant temp of 70 degree's & above this is because the ECU only turns on the closed loop circuit above 70C, below that its runs in the open loop. I would be very surprised if the O2 controller makes no difference as I have sold more than 100 of them with a 100% feedback. Get the bike up to operating temp & ride at a constant throttle below 4500 RPM this is where the O2 controller works.

Is the read light permanently on in the O2 controller when the key is on? Do you have a multimeter?

Hi Kev

I suspect I didn't get up to temperature. I'll try a longer run first thing tomorrow. The red led always seemed to be on. I do have a multimeter.

On a cold start, when the bike uses open loop,would you expect adjusting the fuel mod to make an audible difference to idle?

No worries get back to me if you get stuck & I will Email you the test procedure for testing the O2 controller, solid red light means all OK O2 controller receiving input signal from O2 sensor. I suspect you have not tested the mod as it was designed & governed but the ECU turning on the closed loop circuit.

Hey Kev.

Not good news. Please email me the testing procedure for both the O2 controller and the Kev mod. I've just got back from half an hour on the bike and I can't tell any difference at all with either mod. I tried the Kev mod at every setting from off right round to fully on and couldn't tell a difference at any setting.

Thanks.

Impossible for both mods to be faulty as I test every mod before shipping, I will Email you the fitting tests instructions now. There must be something radically wrong with your bike if it does not respond to more fuel in the open & closed loop maps, I would advise you to remove both mods & fix the fuelling first.

I don't suspect one or both units to be faulty. I am just commenting that on my particular bike there is no perceptible difference with either mod. I have found another local dyno centre who, for �40, will hook the bike up and check the A/F ratio again and allow me to connect and disconnect the mods to actually establish both if they are working, and find what is the best fuel mod setting. I'll have to do this after my trip.

It may be that the mixture is now correct both in open and closed loop. I am just surprised that when others have posted responses like "Wow, it's like a new bike!" that I can't actually tell ANY difference at all.

As I said in my dyno thread, I am not really after performance, or even perfect smooth fuelling. I just want to find if the bike is running OK, and so far after one dyno run and fitting both mods, I am none the wiser.

By the way Kev, the second dyno operator agreed with you 100% about clamping the AIS for the A/F run, and said the previous guy was daft for doing the run without doing anything to the AIS. :)

What happened??

Hamslay could feel any difference with both mods installed, we checked both mods were working as they were designed & they were, I offered a full refund including return postage & the mods were sent back to me, they arrived back with me yesterday & I checked them myself & they are working as designed, I know they correct the A/F ratio as I Dyno test all my mods & the mods have been Dyno tested by other members quite a few time over the past few years.

This is the very first case I have ever had that the O2 controller mod & fuel mod appears to have made no difference to the fuelling what so ever according to Hamslay, never mind the mods now goes from a 100% positive feedback to 99.9%, I respect Hamslay feedback & stand by any mod I sell & life goes on.

Blimey!!! sounds like anyone of the threads you see about using better quality fuel too me it's like night and day but it's amazing how many folks can't tell the difference which could be a totally new thread because the gap in talent that you have between the front and back of Moto GP is exactly the same with road riders and that's not just talent in how fast they ride but what is going on with the bike.

I had 3 years in bike retail(never again) the look on peoples faces when you mentioned pre-load/compression/rebound :hmh:

Kev, your fuel mod TOTALLY transformed my XTX, no question!! This is my third XTX and I only wish I had discovered your mod sooner. Wierd to hear this story but hey, never say never. Thanks Kev!!!!

Wow! I knew I'd get some stick from being the only one who didn't post a glowing report of how my bike was like a new bike, but I didn't expect to be called the worst XT rider out there, or accused of having no idea that suspension was more than just a big spring with a bolt at each end.

I consider myself fully reprimanded and will return to the herd mentality at once.

:)

Well I personally do not think that a "reprimand" is in order Hamslay. Anyone with a brain wishes to improve the way their bike performs, so you are no different to the rest of us. If you do not find the improvements then you are perfectly correct to say so. Kev has acted 100% correctly also (in my opinion) by refunding the dosh. Hey, I cannot understand why your bike did not improve, but that does not mean that I should critisise you.

I think that you cannot claim to find a herd mentality here??

If I were you I would now take my bike to a decent Yamaha dealer who know what they are doing and ask them to sort out the bike. For instance Brian at Alf England can help I am sure. Good luck!!!!

Hamslay I have to say you have been treated fairily and with respect, you probably don't know but one of my painful chores, running this forum is to be a little bit like Big Brother and while I have kept away from this thread because it was handled professionally by Kev, I have read every sentence, analized all opinions, and was also in copy of the private mail that Kev sent you in regards to this matter.

I can see from the outside looking in that your feedback has been accepted as fairily as you gave it, we can only put it down to mystery as to why your bike did not respond to the fuelling mod nor the 02 eliminator mod. However you were not held as an heretic and I would wish other not to contrast Hamslay's opinions into believing it was all in his head because you and I we don't know what gremlins are causing his bike not to react positively to the Mods.

I have been in this forum from it's early days when it had a different name and was run on a Yahoo email group, since 2004 when the bike was first launched and I am aware as well as Kev is, that not two of these bikes are behaving similarly, if they did the Kev Mod would not have a controller pot that goes from min to max but just an on / off switch. And by the same token a Power commander would come pre-programmed without the need for a dedicated map. And also one map might work for a bike and not another and this similar issue does not only happen with Yamaha, but also with Aprilia, etc do you know that Kev makes a mod also for the Aprilia bikes? and KTM's? And other brands we might care to mention?

The issue with the 02 controller and ECU bad fuelling extends to a lot of modern bikes, not just the XT's

So in conclusion, I want to say that I really hate to lock threads because it looks as if we want to make a cover up of the situation, WE are not at fault nor is Kev or Hamslay.

So this thread remains open, Hmslay was issued with a refund so the matter between him and Kev are closed, I don't see the need for further discussion and bickering, I hope that from now if you really need to add anything worthy to this thread that you do it in a fashion where it is understood that the fault must not be pointed at either Hamslay, Kev or others.

Cheers!

Now lets get back to normality.

Well said!!! I would just like to know if and when he gets his bike sorted out, what was the root of his problem. Thanks guys!!!

Going off at a tangent for those reading this thread,when a bike manufacturer builds a bike they have to submit it to the TUV for an emissions test,now they know the rules of the game before they turn up the test is done give or take a few hundred revs at 4250.

So to cheat the test the manafacturers build a fuel map putting as little fuel as possible in at the above setting,giving less emissions,so when you buy any after market fuel mod be it Kev's or the dozens of others versions like his for other models or a PC/Rapid Bike or even a Rexxer what they do is blow fuel into the mid range where the motor is starved of fuel giving an instant response.

Hence why with the gap in the middle filled in it has connected the first part of the fuelling to the last,when I fitted Kev's mod it made a huge difference in the said midrange took a little bit of adjusting to find the optimum but didn't take more than an hour of riding,it's more complex than that but I'm trying keep it in laymans terms.

Anyone looking at a PC,I only bought one because it was cheap and I'm a tinkerer performance wise there's little in it,the PC just make's the bike more civilised with the fuel injection but it's not life and death.

Hey chaps,

My "herd mentality" remark was only intended in response to waynovetten's post that suggested that I must be some kind of imbecile for daring to say I was unable to perceive a difference with Kev's mod. Apologies to anyone that thought I was putting down the forum membership.

In general, this has been a great forum, and I don't want it to seem I am critical of the key members on here, but that post left me a lttle "miffed". :)

Also, I spoke to Kev and we're both good. I totally believe that the units I received were fully functional, and that in most cases they make a marked improvement. Kev was very helpful, very understanding, and very kind in offering a refund.

I would like to point out that in my case, I've never had a problem with the running of the bike. Maybe others, who have felt their bikes are not running well, gain more of an improvement with mods or PCs. In my case, my reason for going for the mods was 100% down to the "suspicious" dyno run I had done. All I wanted was to be confident that the bike was not going to suffer any ill effects from running stage 1 and 2 filters. So it's not that Kev's mods didn't solve a problem with the running, as I didn't have one in the first place. When I spoke to Kev, his advice was that if it seemed to run the same, then it wasn't too lean and the mods weren't needed. Simple. So, I don't know why my bike seems to run OK without mods, or why there was no change for better or worse with the mods, but I do agree with Kev that there's little point in spending money on something that doesn't appear to be needed. I still don't know if the bike is too lean, but Kev assures me that he knows of many XTs running stage 1 and/or 2 without extra fuel, so I am happy to put away the toolkit and leave it alone.

Thanks again to all posters, and a big thanks to Kev for his assistance and generosity. Sorry to be that 0.1%!

:thumbsup:

Some times things in life can not be explained, I know if I had the bike & could do some of my own A/F ratio testing I would know what was going on with the bike.

Question.....
 

Perhaps this bike has already had some mods?????? Just a thought....